Question: Hey Robby, I purchased your book Ignore & Score earlier this spring, and read through it once, and I thought your advice was solid! I feel like since I have read your book, I have gotten a lot better at being relaxed around the girls that I am interested in. I better at not talking about myself as much, keeping them from learning too much about me, and at keeping the conversation fun while not trailing off into something nerdy / geeky.
That’s awesome, thanks for reading my book!
I should note something in what you just said… where you say, “keeping the conversation fun and not trailing off into something nerdy / geeky.” I completely agree with keeping things lite and fun, but try to realize something…. when you judge anything about yourself as nerdy or geeky it sounds like a negative thing. I realize that many of us refer to ourselves as geeky in a proud way, which is fine, but PLEASE don’t let yourself become judgemental or negative about your obsessions, passions or hobbies… even if they might be described as nerdy or geeky.
For example, let’s say you’re into model trains.
I think it’s PERFECTLY cool to be excited to talk about them on a first date… as long as you keep it calibrated.
1) Because when you talk about your hobbies you’re going to be excited and passionate and likely more knowledgeable than her. This means your mood will improve, your energy will be positive, and you’ll express a level of authority on the subject. In my case, years ago, I was deep into making my own watches and leather cuffs. And it always came up because I would always be wearing one. I would buy watch faces that I liked and I would make heavy leather cuffs for them.
2) It’s interesting to hear about something we don’t normally hear about… so for a brief period she might actually enjoy hearing about the underground world of model trains. Or in my case leather crafts.
Now realize I said be “calibrated.”
That means you can share some insights into your hobbies and passions as long as she’s interested… if she’s asking questions and paying attention.
As soon as she stops paying attention, is looking around bored, or stops asking questions about it, then drop it and move onto something else.
3) If, in your heart and guts, you’re kinda nerdy or geeky, you should embrace it, love it, and share it. Why? Because ultimately you’re going to connect better with a girl who likes your nerdy side, not a girl who can’t relate.
It’s attractive when a guy is comfortable in his own skin sharing his desires and interests even when he knows it might push her away. It’s a great way of filtering out women who aren’t good enough for you. 😉
Anyway, I am writing to you because I want some of your thoughts on this situation. I have been using a major online dating site for a while with little success. However, I have been revamping my profile every so often, and crafting my messages to try and grab a woman’s attention. I came across a woman I am very much interested in, and I was able to get some messaging going back and forth between us for the last five days, until I asked her out to dinner this upcoming Friday evening. She accepted, and she messaged me her phone number. I messaged her mine back. Now what do I do?
Do I keep messaging her?
Yes. What ever banter you had going online you can continue via text messaging. I happen to be friends with a dude who wrote a book entirely on texting: Text Appeal
But keep it light… because you haven’t met her yet and you don’t want to become super needy via her cell phone before she has the pleasure of meeting your fine self.
If you’re going to text her again do it between now and your date, and make a reference to something you were already talking about online. For example, I met struck up a conversation with a girl online because she had some super long rainbow socks that I thought were funny looking. So before our first date I texted her a photos from a store I was in and said, “Should I wear these tomorrow night?” The photo looked something like this:
Don’t send her anything mushy like, “I can’t wait for Friday night!” or “I’m really excited to meet you!” or “I’m so nervous.”
This will just tell her you’re over committed to her without having even met her yet. Your value goes out the door.
It’s okay to be excited or nervous, but you don’t need to release that tension by mentioning it.
So keep your text messages short unless she makes them long. I mean, you don’t even know what her texting skills are yet anyways.. she might not text at all!
All that said, if it’s a long wait until your date (More than 3 days) then you should touch base with her at least once via text or email… just to stay connected and friendly before the date.
Do I not message her, and just meet with her for dinner on Friday? What are your thoughts?
See my thoughts above. Don’t let three or four days go by without having talked with her… your job is to keep the energy going.
Also, I am re-reading your book and making sure I am all set for this upcoming date (such as looking my best, well groomed, good hygiene, keeping the conversation fun, appealing to her emotions, having relaxed, open body language, building tension, etc.). I think I have some initial rapport built by sharing jokes and interests that she has enjoyed so far. I want to make sure I don’t fall into the trap of being a nice guy but with no spine.
Being NICE is perfectly okay. Being too mushy or overly emotional or overly interested is bad. Remember… you’re meeting her to find out if she’s good enough FOR YOU, not the other way around. You’re testing HER, not the other way around.
Compliments are okay when they are used sparingly and when you’re not seeking her approval.
Here’s a blog post I wrote once to help remind you: Nice Guys Finish Last
I also don’t want to blow a chance to escalate attraction by physical contact.
One thing I am not used to is building attraction via physical contact (such as holding a girl’s hand at an opportune time, giving her a hug, kissing, etc.). For a first date, what do you think I should look to do when it comes to physical contact, and what cues should I look for?
Since this is the first time meeting you it’s a GREAT opportunity to be overly touchy, in a calibrated way. She doesn’t know you so she’ll just assume you’re just a touchy person.
Remember that touch is a form of intimacy and it builds trust and rapport. Use touch as long as her body language shows approval. If she pulls away or acts funny then take a step back and give her more space… when you react to her reaction it shows her that you’re paying attention and that ultimately she can relax and trust you more.
As a rule I always hug a girl hello like she’s a long lost friend. I’ll even lift her off the ground with my hug… like a friendly bear hug. I can’t say I’ve ever had a girl not hug me when I’ve had a happy and excited face with my arms out wide… it’s naturall to just hug someone when they do that. And this is a great way to quickly break that first-touch barrier.
Here’s a great resource for escalating touch: Escalation
And the last question I have is, if the date goes well, how soon should I contact her to set up another date? There are so many “rules” regarding how long you should wait to text her, or she should text you first, etc. etc. I wonder if you had any thoughts.
Sorry for the essay / multiple questions. I always enjoy reading your insights Robby, take care.
Great questions! Here are my final thoughts….
1) If the date goes great keep it going… I’ll usually line up my date like this…
a) 30 minute coffee at a cute local cake and tea shop.
b) If she’s awesome and fun we’ll either sit there all night talking and eating, or I’ll transition the date to a new location. Each time you change venues it creates a subconscious feeling that she’s on a new date. So if you bounce to three places it’s like you’ve been on three dates! So I’ll move from the coffee house to a nice walk down the street to the many shops for shopping or for real food.
c) I rarely make dates for a Friday … usually because I liked to leave my Friday nights open to close friends and events. So my dates would normally take place on a Sunday or after dinner on a week night, like Wednesday. This way, if she was awesome, I could say, “Hey, are you free at all this Sunday afternoon? I was going to pull out my portable barBQ and have myself a little hot dog picnic at the local park, the weather is supposed to be awesome! Join me!”
d) If the date goes well you can either already have a next date idea ready to go that you can invite her to near the end of the date… like I just explained above … OR you can just end the date with her wondering if you’re going to call.
e) Sometimes if my date goes well I’ll end it with, “You know what, I had a great time! I really enjoyed meeting you.” Big hug and goodbye. If she says “We should do this again” then I’d say “You’re right… hmm… are you free on Sunday afternoon?” If she doesn’t say anything then I’d leave it at that and I’d call or text her the next day.
I’ve found the most success using the energy of a good conversation to make plans to see her again. She’s already happy and in a good mood so it’s a great time to seal the next date. But only do this near the end of the date, and calibrate your plans on her reactions.
If you say something like, “We should do this again, are you free Sunday?” And she says, “I’m not sure I’ll have to get back to you.” That means she’s not that interested. So stop trying to make plans and wait for her to show more interest. Basically, a girl who wants to see you again will jump at the chance, not give you “maybes’.”
You don’t know her yet, don’t let your excitement overwhelm your reason. Imagine this situation… you have 7 dates with 7 girls this week… you need to treat each date knowing you have 6 more dates to get through. So pace yourself. Don’t get over committed just because she’s hot or fun or seemingly perfect. Give yourself time to really get to know the real her.
Allow her time to impress you. Allow her space to show you her real self.
Dating is about finding a girl who meets YOUR expectations. It’s not your job to meet HER expectations. Let her worry about finding her perfect man, even if it’s not you.
Your only job is to have fun, and if you’re making dating stressful then it’s not fun any more.
TRUST ME… it’s more attractive to be with a guy who’s being sincere and honest and having fun over a guy who’s stuck in his head trying to do the right things.
It’s OKAY to fuck up.
It’s OKAY to scare a girl away if you’re a little boring.
It’s OKAY to scare a girl away if you tried to kiss her too soon.
Every fuck up becomes a learning lesson, a stepping stone, and a funny story to share with your guy friends.
Dating is about having fun, being excited to meet someone new, and gaining the social skills it takes to become REALLY good with people. When you’re good with people you’ll be good with women, that’s just how it works
So go out and make as many more dates with as many more women you find interesting or fun!
Good luck, have fun, and enjoy yourself!